Giroux's making promises again

[murraycraven]

@B21 already addressed the Crosby angle, so I'll take the Malkin angle.

Malkin always sucks in the first series. I think the team is used to adapting to it. The guy just doesn't wake up till round two.

We're getting depth scoring though particularly from our defense. Your boys will have to find a way. Seven 20 goal scorers should be able to find a way!

 

 

I agree Polaris... I was saying to B21 yesterday (in the Pens case) that it is only a matter of time until Crosby and Malkin break throught.  I am hoping the same goes for Giroux.   Those type of players aren't typically held down for long stretches.  

 

With all of the 20+ goal scorers on the Flyers I still see this offense go from feast to famon too much.   We are getting scoring from our defense but the entries into the Rags zone have been really bad.   The Rags stand up at the blue line and the Flyers seem to have no answer for it. 

 

I am just happy the Flyers are in the playoffs as the young ones are getting the experience.   Before camp opened this year I had them missing the playoffs.  I thought they would be close but I still think they are a few players away ( and more development) from truly contending.   With that said they proved me wrong all year so maybe they can get past the Rangers.   If Friday night is a loss the serions, IMO, is over.   Maybe Mason will give them a bit of confidence but in the end they need to put pucks in the net and make life hell for Lundy

[OccamsRazor]

I sure hope Giroux can back up his promises by taking his game up another level. The Flyers will not go anywhere without Giroux leading the way, that much is clear. St. Louis has stepped up for the Rags... Giroux needs to one up him.

 

What do you guys think of Giroux's play so far in the series?

 

 

Read more at http://www.philly.com/philly/sports/flyers/20140423_Rangers_beat_Flyers_and_regain_series_lead.html#Ypc2I8bVRYM1Jmb2.99

How about he just promises to score....lets start there....work our way up. Baby steps!!!!

[canoli]

Okay. Good comment. I wouldn't expect him to say anything besides that, but okay.

 

Timonen addressed an actual issue:

"Everything has to happen quicker," defenseman Kimmo Timonen said. "We've got to get pucks through somehow, if it's moving the puck sideways or whatever."

 

The "whatever" had better be MOVE YOUR FEET more.

 

If there's any doubt they were stationary most of the night there won't be after watching the video today. The Rags can celebrate all the blocked shots that's fine and they deserve credit. But the Flyers made it way too easy for them, especially on the PP.

[murraycraven]

But the Flyers made it way too easy for them, especially on the PP.

 

The Flyers are so flat-footed they actually shoot the puck into the shin pads of the Rags.   The need to get moving!  Agree w/ everything you and Kimmo say

[radoran]

If there's any doubt they were stationary most of the night there won't be after watching the video today. The Rags can celebrate all the blocked shots that's fine and they deserve credit. But the Flyers made it way too easy for them, especially on the PP.

 

My girlfriend who is a newbie hockey fan (I've convinced a lifelong Steelers fan to root for the Flyers) even remarked on them just standing around.

 

"What is 93 doing out there?" she asked more than once.

 

The Flyers are so flat-footed they actually shoot the puck into the shin pads of the Rags.   The need to get moving!  Agree w/ everything you and Kimmo say

 

The Rangers were standing around as well - because there was no need for them to move. They didn't have to clog the lanes, the Flyers just shot right into them all night.

[Vanflyer]

No, that's true. But on the other hand, he is being completely stifled by the Rangers coverage.

 

Stifled or AV is outcoaching Berube?

[murraycraven]

Stifled or AV is outcoaching Berube?

 

Very valid point IMO Van...   I am wondering the same thing...

[canoli]

Getting back to Giroux ... (thanks Brel for finishing the stats) ...Why is it so lopsided?

 

Giroux scores = Flyers win.

Giroux picks up an A = Flyers probably win.

Giroux without a point = basically-guaranteed, the Flyers lose.

 

How can this be? We've *got* other guys who score. Seven 20-goal guys this year is impressive, sounds like a dangerous team, an offense that will make life difficult for any team. And yet here we are...down 2-1, out-competed in all 3 games for the most part....the Flyers dropped 6 of 7 coming into the POs (something like that)...

 

and all because 1 guy is shut down? Something weird is going on here.

 

Obviously there are many factors in every game. But those numbers are S-T-A-R-K. Seems you shut down Giroux and you beat the Flyers. Simple as that.

[radoran]

Seems you shut down Giroux and you beat the Flyers. Simple as that.

 

Well, for one thing they haven't really had a "set" line other than the top line for most of the season. Certainly nothing that could be called a reliable "second" line despite the 20-goal scorers.

 

They bounced VLC and Schenn up and down and left and right. Downie, Raffl... Heck, AKESON is on the second PP in the playoffs and he played in the AHL all season.

 

There is no one you really look at on this squad as like a Malkin or a Perry or Pavelski/Marleau or even a Sharp.

 

The top line represents three of the top four scoring forwards. The other was Simmonds who got over half his goals and over a third of his points on the PP and they weren't exactly pretty (and I like Simmonds) - and they were influenced not a little bit by the presence of Giroux as well.

 

You're looking at Giroux with 86 points then Voracek at 62, Simmonds at 60, Hartnell at 52 and then SchennRead/Couturier from 41 to 39 points.

 

They got nice chip in goals from other guys, but nothing really consistent. Certainly not a "threat."

[Bakanekimiwa]

 

I sure hope Giroux can back up his promises by taking his game up another level. The Flyers will not go anywhere without Giroux leading the way, that much is clear. St. Louis has stepped up for the Rags... Giroux needs to one up him.

 

What do you guys think of Giroux's play so far in the series?

 

 

 

Read more at http://www.philly.com/philly/sports/flyers/20140423_Rangers_beat_Flyers_and_regain_series_lead.html#Ypc2I8bVRYM1Jmb2.99

 

 

 

well... his track record IS pretty good with such predictions. Let's hope he's right on again. We need him to be cause this series is over if they don't win Friday night. 

[murraycraven]

and all because 1 guy is shut down? Something weird is going on here.

 

I think this is par for the course this season and last.   We have a bunch of goal scorers but we do not have a single "pure goal scorer" on the Team.   This Team needs someone that can put up goals consistently.   I said it before this team's offense is feast or famine and it has been that way for a long time.   Teams will focus on G and let the rest of the Team try to beat them - shut down G and the rest is pretty easy.  This is exactly what the Rangers are doing in this series.

 

If the Flyers can get secondary scoring they have a good shot at winning the series.  We are in the "famine" stages of our offense.   As much as I like Jake he is not going to take over a game.   B Schenn has been pretty much missing along w/ Read...  Simmonds can score but he needs to work in close and the Flyers really have not got pucks through to Lundy...  Simmonds is one of my favorite players but he can be neutralized if pucks are not getting through.

 

Offseason should start w/ defense and finding a scoring winger.  

[OccamsRazor]

The Flyers are so flat-footed they actually shoot the puck into the shin pads of the Rags

 

YES!!!!!!!!!

 

I was like really that is the best you can do....it's really hard to watch these guys...and some have Cup experience....but you can't tell the way they are playing, someone anyone please lead by example i'm tired of reading them saying the right things only to turn around and play like they are clueless!!!!!!!!!!!!

[canoli]

wow yeah that certainly breaks it down ... shows the holes when you look at who scored what, and when. Simmonds is the best example - lot of PP goals got him to 29 this year.

 

but nothing really consistent. Certainly not a "threat."

 

I guess that's the biggest weakness right there. The scoring after Giroux and Jake isn't a consistent 5 on 5 threat that teams are forced to plan around. The PP can be lethal but it wasn't real great at home only on the road.

 

I sympathize with the coaches; they didn't get big seasons from BSchenn or VLC, guys who were expected to produce more I'm sure. Brayden did have a good season but never established himself as the clear-cut favorite to center the 2nd line.

 

So it turns out once again - the numbers are deceiving.

[murraycraven]

YES!!!!!!!!!

 

I was like really that is the best you can do....it's really hard to watch these guys...and some have Cup experience....but you can't tell the way they are playing, someone anyone please lead by example i'm tired of reading them saying the right things only to turn around and play like they are clueless!!!!!!!!!!!!

 

Maybe if we all cheer really loud while the are on the PP they will actually move and score - you know since the fans are the issue there

[OccamsRazor]

I'm in no way blaming Emery for this series...he shoulda had that Carcillo goal, IMO.

 

 

And the first one was shiitty as hell and a deflater for sure it took them 10 minutes to get over that one....Leighton has looked better than he....

[Bakanekimiwa]

I think this is par for the course this season and last.   We have a bunch of goal scorers but we do not have a single "pure goal scorer" on the Team.   This Team needs someone that can put up goals consistently.   I said it before this team's offense is feast or famine and it has been that way for a long time.   Teams will focus on G and let the rest of the Team try to beat them - shut down G and the rest is pretty easy.  This is exactly what the Rangers are doing in this series.

 

If the Flyers can get secondary scoring they have a good shot at winning the series.  We are in the "famine" stages of our offense.   As much as I like Jake he is not going to take over a game.   B Schenn has been pretty much missing along w/ Read...  Simmonds can score but he needs to work in close and the Flyers really have not got pucks through to Lundy...  Simmonds is one of my favorite players but he can be neutralized if pucks are not getting through.

 

Offseason should start w/ defense and finding a scoring winger.  

 

Read has not only been missing, he's just been playing plain bad. I'm surprised no one's looking into his head shot on Carcillo as well. or.... maybe they are? 

[OccamsRazor]

Maybe if we all cheer really loud while the are on the PP they will actually move and score - you know since the fans are the issue there

 

 

I say scratch GrossmanN and dress Brandon Manning and i know you're like WWWWWWWOOOOOAHHHHH.....

 

 

....but hear me out first the Flyers right now have had trouble getting shots through so Manning may fix that...

 

...maybe he almost lead the Phantoms in SOG with 198 (8 goals and 23 assist) in 73 games pretty damn impressive for a Dman Akeson for comparison had 204. So maybe he can help with being more mobile than Grossmann and help get some shots on net...it is worth a try i think.

 

Doing the same thing yet expecting different results is crazy....i'd look into it.

[Bakanekimiwa]

I say scratch GrossmanN and dress Brandon Manning and i know you're like WWWWWWWOOOOOAHHHHH.....

 

 

....but hear me out first the Flyers right now have had trouble getting shots through so Manning may fix that...

 

...maybe he almost lead the Phantoms in SOG with 198 (8 goals and 23 assist) in 73 games pretty damn impressive for a Dman Akeson for comparison had 204. So maybe he can help with being more mobile than Grossmann and help get some shots on net...it is worth a try i think.

 

Doing the same thing yet expecting different results is crazy....i'd look into it.

 

 

It's AN idea. GrossmanN is seemingly hobbled from injury still. He is looking less mobile than usual. Call me crazy, but I wouldn't mind suiting up Gill. Sure, he's slow as dirt, but he can clear the porch. I thought he stepped in pretty nicely at the end there... and really, what do we have to lose? We're losing this series. Why do we look so bad? The Rangers are simply the better team right now. They're playing better than us in almost every area of the ice, so we don't even deserve to win this thing right now. 

[radoran]

Simmonds is the best example - lot of PP goals got him to 29 this year.

 

Read had 22 - with four SHGs and just 40 points. 18% SHGs (also three empty netters)

 

Schenn with 20 - with five on the PP and just 21 assists. 25% PPGs

 

VLC had 20 - with eight on the PP and just 17 assists. 40% PPGs

 

Simmonds with 29 - 15 on the PP and 31 assists. 51% PPGs

 

Those are your four "non-first-line" 20-goal scorers. 35% of the goals came on special teams and Simmonds with 51% is on the first PP with Giroux.

 

20-goal scorers are great and teams that have many of them have a good chance for depth scoring, but if the guys aren't "20/50" players they simply aren't the same sort of "threat."

[OccamsRazor]

It's AN idea. GrossmanN is seemingly hobbled from injury still. He is looking less mobile than usual. Call me crazy, but I wouldn't mind suiting up Gill. Sure, he's slow as dirt, but he can clear the porch. I thought he stepped in pretty nicely at the end there... and really, what do we have to lose? We're losing this series. Why do we look so bad? The Rangers are simply the better team right now. They're playing better than us in almost every area of the ice, so we don't even deserve to win this thing right now. 

 

 

I'd be ok with Gill if they were scoring and just having problems defending and not issues scoring too....but i'm thinking about improving the skill set and puck possession time and shot choice/quality and they need someone that may help in that area.

 

Manning MAY help with that i don't have a crystal ball to fully say yeah or nah....so i'm just brainstorming and trying to figure what would help their play overall...not sure if it helps but GrossmanN looks like a weak link here more mobility and better puck handling may help the transition game. It be worth a look....something has to give. They are running out of time.

[B21]

Well, for one thing they haven't really had a "set" line other than the top line for most of the season. Certainly nothing that could be called a reliable "second" line despite the 20-goal scorers.

 

They bounced VLC and Schenn up and down and left and right. Downie, Raffl... Heck, AKESON is on the second PP in the playoffs and he played in the AHL all season.

 

 

Wait - Dan Bylsma coaches the Flyers, too?

[brelic]

Have a look at the chart. It shows how many points other Flyers get when Giroux does not get a point, and how they do when Giroux gets at least 1 point. I chose the other six 20-goal scorers as a comparison.

 

It's not at all surprising for Hartnell and Voracek, because they're on the same line. But then you see how much Simmer also depends not only on Giroux but as @radoran showed, the PP. Read's performance was a surprise to me.

 

Anyway, just more evidence that as Giroux goes, so the Flyers go.

 

 

[Samifan]

Maybe Giroux's first guarantee should be to score a goal before he predicts a game 4 win

[murraycraven]

Have a look at the chart. It shows how many points other Flyers get when Giroux does not get a point, and how they do when Giroux gets at least 1 point. I chose the other six 20-goal scorers as a comparison.

 

It's not at all surprising for Hartnell and Voracek, because they're on the same line. But then you see how much Simmer also depends not only on Giroux but as @radoran showed, the PP. Read's performance was a surprise to me.

 

Anyway, just more evidence that as Giroux goes, so the Flyers go.

 

 

wow... that is pretty amazing.  Nice work there Brel... so if G does not score we are screwed - great, just great :unsure:

[radoran]

Have a look at the chart. It shows how many points other Flyers get when Giroux does not get a point, and how they do when Giroux gets at least 1 point. I chose the other six 20-goal scorers as a comparison.

 

It's not at all surprising for Hartnell and Voracek, because they're on the same line. But then you see how much Simmer also depends not only on Giroux but as @radoran showed, the PP. Read's performance was a surprise to me.

 

Anyway, just more evidence that as Giroux goes, so the Flyers go.

 

It surprised me, too. You might want to re-run the numbers because Read had 40 points this season and your chart has him at 52 (everyone else looks fine - I think you duped Hartnell for Read).