Why does everyone hate the Streit signing?

[TedZep]

it's a little too much for a little too long for a guy with a little too one way of a game...

"...who is a little too long in the tooth."

[mojo1917]

@JackStraw

apparently you comprehend as well as i write.

[AndyS]

I think this basically means that we are officially out of the Yandle sweepstakes.

Homer doesn't want to part with Cooter or Schenn. That's a good thing, IMO.

It also means that we've seen the last of Briere & Bryz in Orange and Black. That's not a bad thing either.

Not happy about signing the guy for 4 years, though.

Now go get Bernier and I'll be happy.

P.S. No way Nurse is still there at #11. Find a way to trade up?

[radoran]

The organization certainly put itself in this position, but just because you find yourself in a bad position doesn't mean you should just stay there.

Well, they should try the same strategy that got them into the position they are in. Surely, it will work this time!

I like Gus but a few good weeks at the end of a lost NHL season and a good WC tourney doesn't make him a #1 D. I personally don't think he will ever be that. I'd love to be wrong but I just don't see enough evidence to suggest otherwise.

There's more evidence, IMO, that Gus will emerge as a reliable top pairing defenseman than there is that Steve Mason is going to turn into a reliable, top goaltender.

And even if he does turn into one, how does having Streit around prevent that? Again, after this season, assuming Timo retires, what happens without Streit? You can't go with Gus alone, we saw what happened this year with just one PMD, and Gus is not going to be as good as Timo (keep in mind Timo's $6M also comes off the books, so there's even more cap space).

Nobody the Flyers could draft this year will be that ready in another year. So you end up having to trade or go the FA route anyway. I really don't get why people seem to think that getting Streit has some kind of negative impact on anything.

It's not a negative impact now. It's a negative impact in the future. This is a perfect "win now" move. But it's not a "now" deal - it's a four year deal.

Signing Bryzgalov made all the sense in the world - just not at nine-years, $5.6M and a NMC.

Signing Briere to be a #1 C made sense because you needed a #1 center that year - but it was an eight-year deal.

Signing Streit makes all the sense in the world for next season.

But it is a four year deal.

Like sands through the hour glass, so are second round picks in Homer's pocket...

[murraycraven]

@JackStraw

you basically do not comprehend my point. and you're putting words in my mouth "build up cap space, and then go out and sign and or trade for expensive star players."

not wasting time talking to you, don't appreciate someone who is unable to comprehend and read the words in front of them without adding meaning that was never intended

magnum,

I mean this serioulsy b/c I think there is merit to what I am interpreting from your post... Would the plan be to gain cap space for when our young core is developed?

[JackStraw]

@JackStraw

apparently you comprehend as well as i write.

We do the best we can, eh?

[radoran]

We do the best we can, eh?

You know how we do.

[JackStraw]

Well, they should try the same strategy that got them into the position they are in. Surely, it will work this time!

But this isn't the same strategy. At least it doesn't look that way to me.

There's more evidence, IMO, that Gus will emerge as a reliable top pairing defenseman than there is that Steve Mason is going to turn into a reliable, top goaltender

While I'm not overly confident in Mason, I would still have to dispute that. Mason was a top goalie, if for only one year. He did show the ability. Gus hasn't shown he has the makings of a top pairing guy imo.

It's not a negative impact now. It's a negative impact in the future. This is a perfect "win now" move. But it's not a "now" deal - it's a four year deal.

I think it's a good "patch the hole so the ship doesn't continue to flounder" move. It will take a few years to right the ship (given the appropriate other moves of course) so it makes sense to me.

Signing Bryzgalov made all the sense in the world - just not at nine-years, $5.6M and a NMC.

Signing Vokoun for 2 or 3 years and letting Bob develop made more sense. To me at least.

Signing Briere to be a #1 C made sense because you needed a #1 center that year - but it was an eight-year deal.

I would have been fine with seeing what Carter and Richards could do. I didn't hate the Briere signing but I wasn't an advocate of it. And it was a different kind of move, as were the Bryz and Pronger moves. Those guys were brought in to be THE guy. Streit is being brought in to be A guy. A guy who can help a lot, but not THE guy. And of course the years are nothing like the years of those other deals.

Like sands through the hour glass, so are second round picks in Homer's pocket

If he had traded a 2nd then I would have been pissed

[radoran]

While I'm not overly confident in Mason, I would still have to dispute that. Mason was a top goalie, if for only one year. He did show the ability. Gus hasn't shown he has the makings of a top pairing guy imo.

Mason had one good year. One. And three bad ones. Then he played well seven garbage games after the team was eliminated. Seven games.

I'm willing to give him a chance and the benefit of the doubt. But he is not in any way, shape or form a "proven starter" in the NHL.

Andrew Raycroft is standing over in the corner waving his arms in the air desperately trying to get your attention

I think it's a good "patch the hole so the ship doesn't continue to flounder" move. It will take a few years to right the ship (given the appropriate other moves of course) so it makes sense to me.

I'm not questioning the seaworthiness of the vessel, I'm questioning the Captain who's steering it. Matthew Barnaby steers a straighter line while blitzed driving to his ex's house to harass her at 2 AM.

And don't for a moment think this is a "patch the hole/give it a few years" move.

"Good enough to compete for the Stanley Cup" - I guarandamntee you you will hear that phrase at the announcement of the Streit signing.

Signing Vokoun for 2 or 3 years and letting Bob develop made more sense. To me at least.

That was my preference. But I'm sure the people who screwed that up will get it right the next time. You know, based on their track records.

[JackStraw]

I'm willing to give him a chance and the benefit of the doubt. But he is not in any way, shape or form a "proven starter" in the NHL.

Never said that he was.

I'm questioning the Captain who's steering it.

As are we all. This actually makes me question him a little bit less. Just a little bit.

And don't for a moment think this is a "patch the hole/give it a few years" move.

Oh yeah? Make me! (not think that I mean)

"Good enough to compete for the Stanley Cup" - I guarandamntee you you will hear that phrase at the announcement of the Streit signing.

We would probably hear that anyway. Gotta sell those season tickets.

That was my preference. But I'm sure the people who screwed that up will get it right the next time. You know, based on their track records.

There's a first time for everything. Except when there isn't.

[Lindbergh31]

@brelic - I don't really see that as an actual plan for addressing the shortcomings on the blue line. And I just don't see the 4 years as that big a deal. If he in fact gets a limited NTC then there is always the option of trading him for a bag of pucks after 2 or 3 years. They gave up nothing of value to get him so who would care what the get back for him? And honestly, I think having him for around for three years is good. He's a smart, veteran, leader type. With Pronger gone and Timo soon to follow, there will be a shortage of those types in the Flyers dressing room.

You mean Holmgren didn't give out his usual NMC but only a limited NTC to Streit. That in itself is a win considering Holmgren's history of handing out NMC like candy. Good arguments discussed on both sides of the Streit signing so I guess it's wait and see how he does over the next 4 years. I still think Holmgren is an idiot for the way he handles the cap but he's not shy to try things even if they blow up in his face. I'd love to see Nurse in a Philly uniform at the draft but unless the Flyers trade up I think he's gone. It looks like Carolina is interested in trading the 5th overall pick so maybe Holmgren will be kicking tires on that front.

[JackStraw]

Meltzer talks Streit:

http://www.hockeybuzz.com/blog.php?blogger_id=45#.UcCfHBaNbpW

"A trade for a younger, already contracted defenseman such as Keith Yandle would have come at a very high trading cost, and would have represented a different type of major risk. So pick your poison: A long-term over-35 contract or a depth-resource gutting trade. The Flyers chose the former. The more I think about it, the more I prefer the course they took to the other alternative."

"Adding Streit does nothing to help the Flyers improve their suspect team defense in terms of coverages. But he will help the team to be better on breakouts. Pairings of Timonen with Luke Schenn, Braydon Coburn with Streit and (a healthy) Nicklas Grossmann with Erik Gustafsson would balance off some of the issues the Flyers had last year with puck movement while still having elements of physicality and puck movement.

It's hardly a blueline roster that will strike fear in the hearts of opponents, but it's an improved and more well-blended starting six over last year's squad. players able to play their natural roles. Streit won't have to kill penalties very often, for example, nor will the Flyers need for Coburn to try to be more of a puck mover."

On point, as usual (except when he compares Darnell Nurse to Braydon Coburn).

[radoran]

So pick your poison: A long-term over-35 contract or a depth-resource gutting trade.

"So pick your poison: A Vezina nominee who has played for a Cup winning team or sticking with the young developing goalie?"

Well, that worked out for them, didn't it?

I'm sure they've got it right this time, too.

[OH1FlyersFan]

Amnesty Streit now! :P

[OH1FlyersFan]

it will actually be fun to watch a dman break out of the zone and make a solid first pass

The real question is - will our forwards know what to do with such a pass being completely unfamiliar with and unused to such a thing. That's where the plan breaks down.

[OH1FlyersFan]

Not happy about signing the guy for 4 years, though.

I agree. I don't like the length. But it may have been the only way to do it to minimize the cap hit and, to me, that's preferrable. If you sign him to 2 or 3 years and he wants a certain amount of money, then the amount per year goes up and that negatively imnpacts the cap. The Flyers went 4 years to spread out his salary. I would have like fewer years for fewer dollars, but Streit wasn't going to agree to that. He got the money he wanted, the organization has to take the contract length to manage that -- and when you're starting the season at age 36, the durability odds aren't good.

[Howie58]

Looking at our overpriced defense. How is he so bad? You guys should be complaining of how much we pay our own overrated dmen. This guy will instantly be one of our best dmen with a limited nmc that they can trade after 2 years. Also, don't forget that we gave up pretty much nothing (including our young core) to get him. Let me know what our options are in the free agent market cause I see nobody out there worth anything.

I agree that he is not "so bad." But this deal is part of a larger frame/mindset that seems to go like this: "Don't show much patience with good young players." Don't accept a reality that two or three consecutive sub-par seasons might yield a core that goes to the Cup. And for G_d's sake, don't develop D or G; just work on forwards and we will trade for those positions...generally receiving players past their prime...and pay a sh...tload for them." In other words...what you say is true--Streit isn't so bad. But this deal seems to be part-and-parcel of GM who is more opportunist than strategist.

Best,

Howie

[Dynamo 47]

I had no problem with the signing nor the terms of the contract. We needed defense; particularly a mobile defenseman who can provide some offense. There is little to nothing out there in the free agent market so to acquire Streit without having to give up any of our key youth is a good move in my eyes.

[flyercanuck]

Looking at our overpriced defense. How is he so bad? You guys should be complaining of how much we pay our own overrated dmen. This guy will instantly be one of our best dmen with a limited nmc that they can trade after 2 years. Also, don't forget that we gave up pretty much nothing (including our young core) to get him. Let me know what our options are in the free agent market cause I see nobody out there worth anything.

First, why do we always have to outbid other teams for guys who's game is leaving them?

Second, if our own D is overrated, how is bringing in 35 year old mark Streit for 4 years going to help? He's just not very good defensively.

Third, I wouldn't mind him for one year, maybe two. But FOUR? See Briere signing, Pronger trade, Bryz signing, and project hartnells contract 4 years from now. I heard the same things then...hows that working out for us? If we're overpaying now, who's going to want him two years from now, when his game has gone further south.

And the best thing is, even if HE realizes his game is gone and he retires, we still take the caphit til the end. Bravo!

[flyercanuck]

I still think you have to consider some defenseman benefit your team by the old "best defense is a good offense" train of thought. It DOES work quite well. Puck possession, offensive zone time, etc..

Well, until playoffs at least.

[DaGreatGazoo]

And the best thing is, even if HE realizes his game is gone and he retires, we still take the caphit til the end. Bravo!

Not disagreeing with your points bout Streit, but I think if he decides to retire, he magically gets an injury and ends up on LTIR. That's one of the many stupid things about the over 35 rule.

[flyercanuck]

The organization certainly put itself in this position, but just because you find yourself in a bad position doesn't mean you should just stay there. I like Gus but a few good weeks at the end of a lost NHL season and a good WC tourney doesn't make him a #1 D. I personally don't think he will ever be that. I'd love to be wrong but I just don't see enough evidence to suggest otherwise. And even if he does turn into one, how does having Streit around prevent that? Again, after this season, assuming Timo retires, what happens without Streit? You can't go with Gus alone, we saw what happened this year with just one PMD, and Gus is not going to be as good as Timo (keep in mind Timo's $6M also comes off the books, so there's even more cap space).

Nobody the Flyers could draft this year will be that ready in another year. So you end up having to trade or go the FA route anyway. I really don't get why people seem to think that getting Streit has some kind of negative impact on anything.

The problem is, we ALWAYS have to "go for it". Signing a 35 year old offensive defenceman is something you do when you're THAT type away from contending, no? What's wrong with seeing what we have, find out what our goalie situation is, did we get that bluechip defenceman prospect? This team isn't winning a cup next year, why bring THAT boat anchor (there's that term yet again) in when the last 3 or 4 or 5 boat anchors haven't worked?

[radoran]

Not disagreeing with your points bout Streit, but I think if he decides to retire, he magically gets an injury and ends up on LTIR. That's one of the many stupid things about the over 35 rule.

The NHL allegedly - allegedly - has medical professionals check these things.

[flyercanuck]

I agree that he is not "so bad." But this deal is part of a larger frame/mindset that seems to go like this: "Don't show much patience with good young players." Don't accept a reality that two or three consecutive sub-par seasons might yield a core that goes to the Cup. And for G_d's sake, don't develop D or G; just work on forwards and we will trade for those positions...generally receiving players past their prime...and pay a sh...tload for them." In other words...what you say is true--Streit isn't so bad. But this deal seems to be part-and-parcel of GM who is more opportunist than strategist.

Best,

Howie

Round and round and round she goes. And people wonder why we never win the cup? How about trying a different route?

[DaGreatGazoo]

How about trying a different route?

How about trying a different GM????