Jake Voracek Fight

[EDI-Flyer]

So last night against the Caps Claude Giroux gets dumped on his butt after a hard (clean) hit from Steve Oleksy. Jake Voracek jumps in and gets the jersey up over Oleksy's head before pounding him with several rights to the face, leaving him cut and bruised.

Whilst I am not a huge fan of fights after clean hits I have to say I love the fact that Voracek (first career fight!) stuck up for his linemate in this situation. When you have a guy that doesn't fight against a guy that has a career based on being a pest/hard checker/fighter willing to go to bat that says a fair bit about his character.

http://www.hockeyfig...m/fights/117195

"I'm proud of him," Timonen said. "You don't hit guys like Giroux like that and not pay the price."

I totally agree with Kimo on this one. Whilst I would normally take issue with dumb penalties I have no problem with the ones Jake took even though it cost two goals on the subsequent PP. The fact that we came back to win makes it easier to say that of course but I would still have felt that way had we lost.

So on this occasion a big attaboy Jake - just don't do it too often, no point in damaging your hands on inferior players.

Edited April 1, 2013 by EDI-Flyer

[flyercanuck]

While I hate the clean hit fight, it's nice to see a non-fighter stick up for a teammate. At least it shows life. But they're "Leafing" the season away with these wins. This team is not winning a cup. And making the playoffs will only result in a mediocre draft pick and more pats on the back for Holmgren and laviolette.

[mojo1917]

Yes FC we don't want to "Leaf" this opportunity to draft a difference maker. LOL

[flyerrod]

Whilst I would normally take issue with dumb penalties I have no problem with the ones Jake took even though it cost two goals on the subsequent PP. The fact that we came back to win makes it easier to say that of course but I would still have felt that way had we lost.

I do appreciate the fact that Jake stuck up for Claude after the hit but in a tied game, that was a really boneheaded move. It should not take that kind of adversity to get a team to focus like they did after the fight for the rest of the game. While I laud the outcome of the fight, trading Jake for Olesky is not usually what i would consider a "good" trade off.

Edited April 1, 2013 by flyerrod

[flyercanuck]

@flyerrod

In a playoff game it's a bad move. At this point it's "team building".

[TedZep]

Sticking up for your teammate is one thing, but that was a clean check and Giroux wasn't hurt, except maybe his pride got a little sore. When he almost scored shorthanded... that would have been a very nice "thank you" to Voracek.

[flyercanuck]

Sticking up for your teammate is one thing, but that was a clean check and Giroux wasn't hurt, except maybe his pride got a little sore. When he almost scored shorthanded... that would have been a very nice "thank you" to Voracek.

Sure. But pounding on a guy for a clean hit has become the norm in the NHL.

[Philly29]

I loved it....hey Crosby is an untouchable "RIGHT" so why not Giroux then...I love Jake sticking up for his Captain, indeed you do not want your skilled guys getting hurt but that was some old time hockey you know it doesnt half to be a goon or tough guy that sticks up for the teamate all the time. They are all out there together...

[DaGreatGazoo]

The ONLY thing Jake did wrong was not take his dome-piece off first...if he did, it's only a 2 mins PK. Not that Jake would know the NHL instigator rules!

This team is going nowhere..it's about time they started playing for each other, cause they sure as heck haven't played for the fans most of this season.

[jammer2]

Kieth Jones talking after the game on Sportsnet "Flyer fans were universally furious after nobody stuck up for Giroux in the previous games, so Jake's fight was welcomed.....always liked Kieth.

[TedZep]

Not that Jake would know the NHL instigator rules!

He got 19 minutes to review and think about it. Having handily won his first fight (per someone on this board), maybe that will become his thing, train with Rinaldo and Shelley - April Fools!

[DaGreatGazoo]

He admits as much here...

Voracek, who has 35 points, did not know about the visor rule. "I ran up to him and he turned around and I had no choice after that," Voracek said. "Obviously I wasn't very happy about the result, basically 19 minutes for a fight and be thrown out of the game. I did what I did, if I knew I would get 19 minutes plus 4 minutes and a penalty kill I wouldn't do that."

[CoachX]

The ONLY thing Jake did wrong was not take his dome-piece off first...if he did, it's only a 2 mins PK. Not that Jake would know the NHL instigator rules!

This team is going nowhere..it's about time they started playing for each other, cause they sure as heck haven't played for the fans most of this season.

Winning and lsoing games is not the priority right now. Playing hard hockey and getting a sense of team is. I would much rather this team lose every game the rest of the way in exchange for punishing other teams. I know they aren't built for that and I don't mean "goon" it up. But if something like this happens again, someone else needs to jump in. Liberties are not a luxury this team can afford to give up.

[jammer2]

@CoachX Totally agree with that post coach, BUT....the Jake fight was only ok in the *context* of what happened to G in the last game. I really, really hate these fights after clean checks....it's a curse on the league right now. But I get your point in general, it's a valid one.

Edited April 1, 2013 by jammer2

[King Knut]

Unlike you, I am a huge fan of fights after clean hits.

You fight a guy not because you're the referee and he broke the rules, you fight him because he did something you're interested in making people think twice about doing again. The Flyers have a terribly history of standing up for their stars like this. It's not so much a message of "our star can't protect himself" as Clarke used to seem to think, but more a message of "you hit him, you hit all of us and the rest of us will hit back. he'd do the same for me btw". I'm thrilled to see Jake break the mold and go after him. IN the long run it's well worth the penalty you take.

THAT SAID regarding the fight, it's important that the message about taking off the helmet with a mask get across. and Jake should have known.

HOWEVER... how the hell does Jake get an instigator for that? watch the replay... he steps in and pushes him off and says something, but Olesky is ready to go and drops the gloves first. Sure Jake probably asked, but he ASKED. he let him know. He knew what was happening and he said okay let's do it. FUTHERMORE, how does Jake get a misconduct for that? It was a straight up fight? He pushed the guy off and asked him to go and they went. The other guy dropped first. Jake didn't know about the mask, and he got a minor for that as is prescribed by the rules. Other than that all Jake did was win the damn fight.

Where's the misconduct come from? Anyone know?

Whilst I am not a huge fan of fights after clean hits I have to say I love the fact that Voracek (first career fight!) stuck up for his linemate in this situation. When you have a guy that doesn't fight a

[King Knut]

We've lost an awful lot of key players and captains in particular over the past 15 years due to so called "clean" hits.

I'm sick of technically "legal" hits being deemed "clean". They're doing it with the intention of injuring the other player in IMHO that makes the fight a legit option.

The hit on Giroux was legal, but it wasn't clean in my opinion. Any time you blind side a guy and you know he has no idea you're coming, you're playing a bit dirty IMHO. Which is fine with me... it really is... as long as there are consequences for that and Jake brought the consequences.

The refs can't throw you in the box or out of the game for a legal hit. Well they can and they have, but they don't do it all that often. If you want them to stop, your team has to take matters into their own hands. This was a clear concise message and I thought it was perfect. I just have no idea how Jake earned the extra 12 minutes.

@CoachX Totally agree with that post coach, BUT....the Jake fight was only ok in the *context* of what happened to G in the last game. I really, really hate these fights after clean checks....it's a curse on the league right now. But I get your point in general, it's a valid one.

@CoachX Totally agree with that post coach, BUT....the Jake fight was only ok in the *context* of what happened to G in the last game. I really, really hate these fights after clean checks....it's a curse on the league right now. But I get your point in general, it's a valid one.

[King Knut]

That's not strictly true.

It may have become the norm for "BIG" or "Dangerous" hits that may have been deemed "legal" but they were big or dangerous and could end a guy's career so I could give a crap what the rules say. You stand up for your guy.

I've watched too many stars on this team lose their careers years too soon because of crap "legal" hits like that which were not deterred by the other players on the ice.

It happens too much, it doesn't need to.

What I will say is that I thought Olesky did a good job of hitting Giroux but not KILLING him which he technically could have done in that situation according to the rules.

Sure. But pounding on a guy for a clean hit has become the norm in the NHL.

Edited April 1, 2013 by King Knut

[CoachX]

i agree with the idea of a fight coming after a hard hit, especially when it invovles a star player. Other teams need to be aware that laying a shouolder into Giroux is going to bring a rebuttal of sort. When they are thinking about that, its harder to think about the game at hand

[Polaris922]

This one cuts both ways... Instigator earned because the issue was the hit with Giroux, not Voracek. I'm torn on it because fighting in response to a clean hit that doesn't injure your guy is chickenshit stuff. You can't soapbox you don't want the physical taken out of the game then defend fights over clean hits at the same time. Whatever happened to hit him back mentality, within the rules of the game??

That's how the Pens have been dealing with it lately. Is it frustrating to see your star player thumped? Absolutely... But it's worth the wait when the guy gets thumped back to pay for it, and no penalty time awarded. Voracek is your best scorer this season. If you'd lost the game to those two goals, or Voracek had broken his hand...?

[radoran]

On the plus side, the team has started to show signs of life and competitiveness. Voracek stood up for Giroux (I'm not a fan of the fight-to-follow-hit, either), the team fought back for the overtime win and they're two points out of the playoffs.

On the other hand, they had to climb out of a two goal hole created by the subsequent PPs; they supposedly are paying Jody Shelley $1.1M to fill this role from the pressbox while Jake Voracek has to step up (and gets an extra penalty because, hey, Jake Voracek doesn't freaking fight); they had to make a point about "protecting" Giroux because they had failed to answer the bell in previous games; and they're as close to last place now as they were to the playoffs when the week started...

Two steps forward, two steps back.

Which way's the next step?

[Polaris922]

Ok so did this really send a message? For example... Lets say the Flyers play the Pens tonight. A guy like Dougles Murray or Derek Engelland hits Giroux hard but clean. Is Voracek going to step up and throw punches? Wouldn't your team be better served if he didnt? Who's going to do it then?

Unless the hit is dirty, keep your gloves on and hit back legally.

[B21]

Sure. But pounding on a guy for a clean hit has become the norm in the NHL.

This is why the players should not be allowed to police themselves. It's bad enough that Shanahan will from time to time screw guys for clean hits.

[AlaskaFlyerFan]

Prior to the instigator rule, you didn't hit a player of Giroux's caliber like that. I don't have a problem with the fight.

[radoran]

Ok so did this really send a message? For example... Lets say the Flyers play the Pens tonight. A guy like Dougles Murray or Derek Engelland hits Giroux hard but clean. Is Voracek going to step up and throw punches? Wouldn't your team be better served if he didnt? Who's going to do it then?

Unless the hit is dirty, keep your gloves on and hit back legally.

Well, we're not talking about Kimmo Timonen, here

Voracek fighting on a regular basis is ridiculous. Voracek fighting to make this point? Priceless.

[Polaris922]

@radoran

Just saying he's not really making a point other than your best goal scorer missing 19 minutes, costing his team 2 goals, and risking injury over a clean hit. It's not like teams are going "oh my I better not hit Giroux or big bad Voracek is gonna get me".

Edited April 2, 2013 by Polaris922