dilbert719 Posted July 19, 2012 Share Posted July 19, 2012 On a vaguely related note, I fully expect the new CBA to modify the 35+ contract thing. Instead of contracts signed over age 35 not coming off the cap, I think it'll be contracts that take players past age 35 won't come off if they retire. Basically, shift the provision from date of signing to the end of the deal. That'd probably help put the kibosh on ludicrously long-term deals without outright putting a max years limit on them. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bertmega Posted July 19, 2012 Share Posted July 19, 2012 I like Weber a lot, and want him in a Flyers uniform more than any fan out there, but this is the wrong way of doing business in my book. I am not a huge fan of the offer sheet business. It kind of screws the small market teams; which, I thought the entire salary cap and parts of the current CBA wanted to prevent. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fanaticV3.0 Posted July 19, 2012 Share Posted July 19, 2012 The big difference is that Pronger was an "over 35" contract, so the Flyers are on the hook for the whole thing. Not so with Weber. If he retires at 36 or whatever, the Flyers just say goodbye and good luck.Weren't Hatcher and Rathje both under 35 and if so, why did they have to continue paying them when they couldn't play? A LTIR thing? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fanaticV3.0 Posted July 19, 2012 Share Posted July 19, 2012 how can i say that?!?!!? well, his annual cap hit in 2025 will be the same as next year. a very manageable $7.1m/yr which is actually LESS than his cap hit from last year. in 2025 that will be pennies.he's the best D man in the world right now. he instantly makes the flyers a serious stanley cup caliber team. he's just turning 27. D men are entering their prime at that age. so you have the best D man in the world entering his prime. he's extremely durable. last 4 years he played nearly all games. Lidstrom just retired at what? 42? playing at a high level mind you.it's entirely possible weber could play out that deal. if not.. well, it's heavily front loaded and again.. that $7.1 cap hit will be nothing at the end of this deal.If the league ever gets to the point where $7 mil isn't a lot of money, they are in trouble; because the sport ain't the popular.You might want to find another measuring stick other than one of the best defenseman of all time. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bakanekimiwa Posted July 19, 2012 Share Posted July 19, 2012 If the league ever gets to the point where $7 mil isn't a lot of money, they are in trouble; because the sport ain't the popular.You might want to find another measuring stick other than one of the best defenseman of all time.ok.. why you being a d o u c h e nozzle now? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bakanekimiwa Posted July 19, 2012 Share Posted July 19, 2012 btw.. dreger says the preds are going to issue a statement at some point today. eeeinnteresting Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JackStraw Posted July 19, 2012 Share Posted July 19, 2012 Weren't Hatcher and Rathje both under 35 and if so, why did they have to continue paying them when they couldn't play? A LTIR thing?I would assume neither wanted to retire. From the player's POV, why not stay on LTIR and get paid. I think in Hatcher's case it was just one year, in Rathje's it was several. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jkearse123 Posted July 19, 2012 Share Posted July 19, 2012 http://predators.nhl.com/club/news.htm?id=638229Preds Andy Reid like response Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bakanekimiwa Posted July 19, 2012 Share Posted July 19, 2012 http://predators.nhl...s.htm?id=638229Preds Andy Reid like responseyeah.. srsly. seems to leave the door wide open for them not signing it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
radoran Posted July 19, 2012 Share Posted July 19, 2012 I would assume neither wanted to retire. From the player's POV, why not stay on LTIR and get paid. I think in Hatcher's case it was just one year, in Rathje's it was several.They had contracts paying them their actual salary every year. Rathje needed to stay on the roster to keep getting paid - and had no incentive to retire.Weber will have 97% of his money in the first 11 years of the deal. If he wants to take his $111M and not play three years at $1M each, he can do that. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AndyS Posted July 19, 2012 Share Posted July 19, 2012 btw.. dreger says the preds are going to issue a statement at some point today. eeeinnterestingIf Weber does not want to stay in Nashville (and all signs point to that being the case), they can't match the offer.You can't keep a guy (even for that money) that long when he just doesn't want to be there. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fanaticV3.0 Posted July 19, 2012 Share Posted July 19, 2012 He would basically need to retire at that point. Cap hit comes off. See: Andreychuk, Dave.The Flyers aren't very likely to make this move unless Weber wants them to. I can almost guarandamntee there is a NMC involved in this offer...I fully expect them to do the same thing with Bryzgalov before the end of that deal, with Bryz likely getting a swan song in the KHLNobody expects Kovalchuk to be playing at 43....I don't think anybody expects many/any of these guys signing these longterm deals to be playing in the latter stages of the contract.As long as there is a way to get out of it down the line, I'm ok with it. It sounds like football, but with a few extra steps? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
radoran Posted July 19, 2012 Share Posted July 19, 2012 I don't think anybody expects many/any of these guys signing these longterm deals to be playing in the latter stages of the contract.As long as there is a way to get out of it down the line, I'm ok with it. It sounds like football, but with a few extra steps?As long as the player is under 35 and is willing to reitre before the end of the contract, you're all good. That's why these are all so ridiculously front-loaded.How this isn't blatant "circumvention" I am not sure. Perhaps there will be penalties on teams if players in these deals start to bail early. But that's another story for another day.Good to see you, BTW. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DinahMoeHumm Posted July 19, 2012 Share Posted July 19, 2012 (edited) http://predators.nhl...s.htm?id=638229Preds Andy Reid like responseThought this post in the comments section of that article was funny...Here's the real translation:"We knew teams wanted Weber, but don't value him as much as other teams do, proven by taking him to Salary arbitration last year and claiming he was equivalent to Dustin Byfuglien-- So you can imagine our surprise when a team offered him a contract equivalent to 11% of our franchise net worth.Do we have the money right now? No, but we're currently working on a new CBA designed to completely screw over players and want to roll back their salaries by 25%, which would make this contract more affordable." Edited July 19, 2012 by DinahMoeHumm 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Podein25 Posted July 19, 2012 Share Posted July 19, 2012 @DinahMoeHummWeber = Big Buff? Hilarious. Like they're even close. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DinahMoeHumm Posted July 19, 2012 Share Posted July 19, 2012 @Podein25Yeah, that's pretty hilarious to draw a boneheaded comparison like that. I guess those is the ropes in salary arbitration. But they could have at least drawn a comparison that could be taken seriously. :blink: Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mojo1917 Posted July 19, 2012 Share Posted July 19, 2012 i'd rather see how manning develops.... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Spinorama Posted July 19, 2012 Share Posted July 19, 2012 i'd rather see how manning develops.... haha Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DinahMoeHumm Posted July 19, 2012 Share Posted July 19, 2012 i'd rather see how manning develops.... Good one! Well, however the situation turns out, I'll say this - Holmgren has some seriously gigantic cream-filled stones to pull a move like this! I kinda have to admire that, even as a fan of a rival team. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bakanekimiwa Posted July 19, 2012 Share Posted July 19, 2012 If Weber does not want to stay in Nashville (and all signs point to that being the case), they can't match the offer.You can't keep a guy (even for that money) that long when he just doesn't want to be there.right!? it's quite the conundrum for nashville. you almost gotta feel sorry for them. almost... 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lunatic Posted July 19, 2012 Share Posted July 19, 2012 however this shakes out... i think this has to be considered a pretty brilliant move by the flyers. there is no lose in this situation for us. weber is either going to be a flyer or a pred for the rest of his career. homer took control of the situation in a big way and has narrowed all options to just those 2. very very smart.anyone who's questioning the length and terms of the deal needs to look at the bigger picture. this is *the* one player you throw the bank at. but, more than that... this offer seems to be more of a forcing of the hand of nashville. poille wasn't liking our trade offers, i suppose. well, now he has to consider those more seriously.worst case scenario is basically nashville matching and we go home empty handed. but so does vancouver, detroit, pitt, rags... on and on. i can't see a negative to this move as surprising as it is.I absolutely agree. Homer has kept Weber out of the East and away from everyone but Nashville, similar to what he did he did by making obscene offers to Paresi and Suter.Brilliant off-season by Homer. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dilbert719 Posted July 19, 2012 Share Posted July 19, 2012 You might want to find another measuring stick other than one of the best defenseman of all time.What are the appropriate measuring sticks for the best defenseman active today? The previous best defenseman seems a logical one to me. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lindbergh31 Posted July 19, 2012 Share Posted July 19, 2012 Truely amazing. Never a dull day in Flyer Land. According to reports:Here are the compensation ranges:$1,110,249 or below - No CompensationOver $1,110,249 to $1,682,194 - 3rd round pickOver $1,682,194 to $3,364,391 - 2nd round pickOver $3,364,391 to $5,046,585 - 1st round pick, 3rdOver $5,046,585 to $6,728,781 - 1st round pick, 2nd, 3rdOver $6,728,781 To $8,410,976 - Two 1st Round Picks, 2nd, 3rdOver $8,410,976 - Four 1st Round PicksI fully expect Nashville to match the offersheet. What a disaster for their Franchise if they don't!Considering Poile and Holmgren have a good trade history together, what's to say if Poile said to Holmgren to give Weber an offer sheet and structure the offer in a way that the Nashville couldn't match but looks good in the eyes of the fans. If you read some of the comments on the fan forums, tsn and yahoo, some preds fans are hoping Poile doesn't match the offer. Nashville has a lot of young defensemen in their system so whether they lose Weber this season or next year for nothing. If Weber really wanted to stay in Nashville he would have signed a long term deal by now and Poile wouldn't have been shopping him around this summer. I think Weber told Poile he wasn't going to resign long-term in Nashville, so Poile knew that Philly needed a number one defenseman and weren't going to gut their team to trade for Weber so they tried to make a deal but couldn't, so an offer sheet was a last resort. This way it controls to a certain extent as not having Weber end up in Detroit or another western team. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JackStraw Posted July 19, 2012 Share Posted July 19, 2012 Just saw this on hfboards:Weber: "I signed long-term with the Flyers because I want to win a Cup, and this seems like the easiest way to wind up doing that in LA." 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dilbert719 Posted July 19, 2012 Share Posted July 19, 2012 Just saw this on hfboards:Weber: "I signed long-term with the Flyers because I want to win a Cup, and this seems like the easiest way to wind up doing that in LA." I don't care who you are, that's funny right there. [/LarryTheCableGuy] 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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