2024 Entry Level Draft - Confirmed Flyers pick at #12

[BobbyClarkeFan16]

53 minutes ago, RonJeremy said:

Yeah,society in general is a lot different in that respect. There are very few of those tough kids any more, the Tkachuck brothers are classic old school, but not too many players like them are around these days.

Everybody now seems to be advanced stats driven. The eye test is not important anymore. A spreadsheet with various numbers is how the game is moving now. But, everything is cyclical and what is old will eventually become new again. 

 

I see the benefits of advanced stats, but you still have to play. They haven't really found a five balance yet. 

 

I'll also throw this out - the instigator rule has really changed the game as well in that it has allowed the rats to do what they want and not face any repercussions. Players are no longer allowed to police themselves. Remove they useless rule and the Tocchet/Neely type players will make a comeback.

[JR Ewing]

3 hours ago, BobbyClarkeFan16 said:

Everybody now seems to be advanced stats driven. The eye test is not important anymore. A spreadsheet with various numbers is how the game is moving now. But, everything is cyclical and what is old will eventually become new again. 

 

I see the benefits of advanced stats, but you still have to play. They haven't really found a five balance yet. 

 

I'll also throw this out - the instigator rule has really changed the game as well in that it has allowed the rats to do what they want and not face any repercussions. Players are no longer allowed to police themselves. Remove they useless rule and the Tocchet/Neely type players will make a comeback.

 

There's all sorts of room in today's game for players like Tocchet and Neely, because besides being tough, they were highly skilled. There's really no place for stick-optional players, and the salary cap got rid of them as much as anything else did.

 

Edited June 22 by JR Ewing

[flyercanuck]

14 hours ago, RonJeremy said:

There are very few of those tough kids any more, the Tkachuck brothers are classic old school, but not too many players like them are around these days.

 

Lol...Tkachuk, who's showed up for ONE game in the Stanley Cup Finals, going into game 7? The same Tkachuk who didn't have it in him to help the team that drafted him get better, and wanted the easy way out of getting traded to a contender? 

 

You know who's tougher than that? The Oilers roster who were down 3-0 and never gave up. 

 

Edited June 22 by flyercanuck

[RonJeremy]

44 minutes ago, flyercanuck said:

 

Lol...Tkachuk, who's showed up for ONE game in the Stanley Cup Finals, going into game 7? The same Tkachuk who didn't have it in him to help the team that drafted him get better, and wanted the easy way out of getting traded to a contender? 

 

You know who's tougher than that? The Oilers roster who were down 3-0 and never gave up. 

 

Everything,  you said is true but they are still physically tough, maybe not mentally tough .

[jammer2]

3 hours ago, RonJeremy said:

Everything,  you said is true but they are still physically tough, maybe not mentally tough .

Speaking of physically tough...

Sam Bennett had one of the worst combine results of all time. He famously could not muster one single pull up. Flash forward to this year's finals...he threw 15 hits in game #2, his physicality dominated the play and won many puck battles in the Panthers win. The moral of this story is pretty obvious. A lot of combine results don't translate to the on ice product. 

[JR Ewing]

1 minute ago, jammer2 said:

Speaking of physically tough...

Sam Bennett had one of the worst combine results of all time. He famously could not muster one single pull up. Flash forward to this year's finals...he threw 15 hits in game #2, his physicality dominated the play and won many puck battles in the Panthers win. The moral of this story is pretty obvious. A lot of combine results don't translate to the on ice product. 

 

Yeah, the combine really doesn't mean much at all. It's about 3/4 a chance to see which kids have the biggest arms, and almost everything other than the V02 Max test are pretty meaningless, since none of that stuff is happening on ice with the boys wearing skates.

 

[mojo1917]

So anyone want to speculate on the Flyers/Sens rumors here?

 

I've read many scenarios. 

I think my favorite is Laughton and 12 for 7 and Chabot and his contract. 

Gives OTT some cap flexibility,  still gets them a good top  15 draft pick player and Laughton.

The Flyers get a crack at one of the top 6 defensemen or maybe Catton. A good to very good NHL player to pair with Drysdale for a few years.

His cap hit is high and he has a modified nmc that starts this season so maybe it doesn't happen.

I think I rather this than a Chycryn centered deal, though I think Chycryn fits a competitive timeline a little better.

Thoughts?

[ctid]

31 minutes ago, mojo1917 said:

So anyone want to speculate on the Flyers/Sens rumors here?

 

I've read many scenarios. 

I think my favorite is Laughton and 12 for 7 and Chabot and his contract. 

Gives OTT some cap flexibility,  still gets them a good top  15 draft pick player and Laughton.

The Flyers get a crack at one of the top 6 defensemen or maybe Catton. A good to very good NHL player to pair with Drysdale for a few years.

His cap hit is high and he has a modified nmc that starts this season so maybe it doesn't happen.

I think I rather this than a Chycryn centered deal, though I think Chycryn fits a competitive timeline a little better.

Thoughts?

Could really be one of many different packages, as you are alluding to. Either way this will be a real test for Danny B in terms of tarde negotiations. And if something happens, should really tell us more clearly what Danny B and co have in mind for the future. Is it a Farabee for Chychrun? Are they going for the 7th, while keeping the 12th? If so then Konecny has to be involved. If it's 12+ to move up to 7, that I dont get to be honest...if they move up and pick a Catton, Yakemchuck, Helenius then they should have just stayed put and they will most likely get one of them at 12. But if it's because they want a chance at a Buium, then it makes sense. I really want the 12th and the 7th (one of the defenders and one of the centers), but no way that happens without dealing konecny, and I doubt Danny has the cojones to pull that trigger. Hope I'm wrong. 

 

I sincerely hope we stay clear of any of the Sens players in the rumour mill. So no thanks to Chatbot, Chychrun, Pinto...Greig would be good, but doubt he is in play. I just feel that we actually have some good trade chips here in Farabee, Frost (I want him to stay), Laughton, Konecny. All are from a position of strength in terms of dealing them. They certainly are not at negative value. Not often the Flyers are in this position, so hope they leverage it properly. I want Laughton, Konecny and Farabee to be traded for picks/prospects, I like Farabee but something tells me this is the right time to trade him, if not now then at deadline or next summer. I don't see a long term future for him here. Michkovs, Tippet, Foerster are a lock for 3/4 top wing positions. If Konecny resigns then top 2 lines wing positions are set. If not Brink, Tuomala can fight for the last, or some unknown down the road...so for me that leaves Farabee the odd man out especially since he will most likely not be worth his next contract.

[BobbyClarkeFan16]

Honestly there really isn't much from Ottawa that appeals to me as a Flyers fan.  Tkachuk, Stutzle and Sanderson are all out of the equation. Pinto isn't better than any of the current forwards here in Philadelphia. Greig has made it clear from previous interviews that he doesn't want to be in Philadelphia because his dad works for the team. Josh Norris has a bum shoulder. Thomas Chabot is a bum. Jacob Chychrun is in the final year of his deal and plays the left side, where the Flyers are already loaded with defensemen there. 

 

I don't see a match with Ottawa. Buffalo is another story though....

[RonJeremy]

43 minutes ago, ctid said:

Could really be one of many different packages, as you are alluding to. Either way this will be a real test for Danny B in terms of tarde negotiations. And if something happens, should really tell us more clearly what Danny B and co have in mind for the future. Is it a Farabee for Chychrun? Are they going for the 7th, while keeping the 12th? If so then Konecny has to be involved. If it's 12+ to move up to 7, that I dont get to be honest...if they move up and pick a Catton, Yakemchuck, Helenius then they should have just stayed put and they will most likely get one of them at 12. But if it's because they want a chance at a Buium, then it makes sense. I really want the 12th and the 7th (one of the defenders and one of the centers), but no way that happens without dealing konecny, and I doubt Danny has the cojones to pull that trigger. Hope I'm wrong. 

 

I sincerely hope we stay clear of any of the Sens players in the rumour mill. So no thanks to Chatbot, Chychrun, Pinto...Greig would be good, but doubt he is in play. I just feel that we actually have some good trade chips here in Farabee, Frost (I want him to stay), Laughton, Konecny. All are from a position of strength in terms of dealing them. They certainly are not at negative value. Not often the Flyers are in this position, so hope they leverage it properly. I want Laughton, Konecny and Farabee to be traded for picks/prospects, I like Farabee but something tells me this is the right time to trade him, if not now then at deadline or next summer. I don't see a long term future for him here. Michkovs, Tippet, Foerster are a lock for 3/4 top wing positions. If Konecny resigns then top 2 lines wing positions are set. If not Brink, Tuomala can fight for the last, or some unknown down the road...so for me that leaves Farabee the odd man out especially since he will most likely not be worth his next contract.

Farabee is our only natural LW with some offensive ability. We can’t have all right handed left wings, so maybe we can move Michkov to left wing since he’s a lefty, especially if Farabee is traded. I also want TK gone,he can get us the most back in a trade and Poehling has made Laughton expendable. Lacyinski also had a good year for the Phantoms and he could be a fourth line center as well.

[radoran]

47 minutes ago, RonJeremy said:

so maybe we can move Michkov to left wing since he’s a lefty,

 

You're thinking too small...

 

If I squint real hard I can already hear Bill Clement calling Michkov a natural center.

 

[jammer2]

3 hours ago, ctid said:

Could really be one of many different packages, as you are alluding to. Either way this will be a real test for Danny B in terms of tarde negotiations. And if something happens, should really tell us more clearly what Danny B and co have in mind for the future. Is it a Farabee for Chychrun? Are they going for the 7th, while keeping the 12th? If so then Konecny has to be involved. If it's 12+ to move up to 7, that I dont get to be honest...if they move up and pick a Catton, Yakemchuck, Helenius then they should have just stayed put and they will most likely get one of them at 12. But if it's because they want a chance at a Buium, then it makes sense. I really want the 12th and the 7th (one of the defenders and one of the centers), but no way that happens without dealing konecny, and I doubt Danny has the cojones to pull that trigger. Hope I'm wrong. 

 

I sincerely hope we stay clear of any of the Sens players in the rumour mill. So no thanks to Chatbot, Chychrun, Pinto...Greig would be good, but doubt he is in play. I just feel that we actually have some good trade chips here in Farabee, Frost (I want him to stay), Laughton, Konecny. All are from a position of strength in terms of dealing them. They certainly are not at negative value. Not often the Flyers are in this position, so hope they leverage it properly. I want Laughton, Konecny and Farabee to be traded for picks/prospects, I like Farabee but something tells me this is the right time to trade him, if not now then at deadline or next summer. I don't see a long term future for him here. Michkovs, Tippet, Foerster are a lock for 3/4 top wing positions. If Konecny resigns then top 2 lines wing positions are set. If not Brink, Tuomala can fight for the last, or some unknown down the road...so for me that leaves Farabee the odd man out especially since he will most likely not be worth his next contract.

Same here...get younger, trade Kons, Farabee, Laughton for picks and prospects. I dont mind Frost, but think a deal for Pinto would be an even swap...Pinto might even have a tad more upside. The key for me, is to get #7 WITHOUT giving up #12. Get the 1C of the future...and the pp Dman of the future. None of the Sens Dmen interest me. If Lindstrom and Catton are gone at 7 go pp dman and Helinus at #12. Lots of different ways to change the franchise for the better next Friday and THAT is very exciting. BIG TEST FOR DANNY!!

[flyercanuck]

9 hours ago, RonJeremy said:

so maybe we can move Michkov to left wing

 

 

 

 

 

Lets take one of the most talented prospects the Flyers have ever had and force him to play where he isn't comfortable. Get him a legit centre, that's what we should be doing.

 

Welcome to the Flyers Matvei...y'know, we're a little short on talent in the net right now, try this blocker on for size.  #Flyerhockey.

 

We've been watching Flyer management force square pegs into round holes so long we're starting to think like them. 

Edited June 23 by flyercanuck

[GratefulFlyers]

6 hours ago, jammer2 said:

The key for me, is to get #7 WITHOUT giving up #12.

 

Yeah trading for 7 would be great but probably not at the expense of losing 12. The Flyers keep telling us they're "in it for the long haul" etc. This would be a great way to prove it. No one except Michkov is off-limits. That leaves a lot of options to trade up w/out losing the 12.

[RonJeremy]

50 minutes ago, flyercanuck said:

 

 

 

 

 

Lets take one of the most talented prospects the Flyers have ever had and force him to play where he isn't comfortable. Get him a legit centre, that's what we should be doing.

 

Welcome to the Flyers Matvei...y'know, we're a little short on talent in the net right now, try this blocker on for size.  #Flyerhockey.

 

We've been watching Flyer management force square pegs into round holes so long we're starting to think like them. 

You are going a little overboard,  did he tell you personally he isnt comfortable on left wing? A guy that has that kind if talent can adapt and play anywhere. It's worth a try to balance out the scoring, if after ten games he can't do it, you can move him back. Foerester, Tippett and TK all moved to the off wing and did fine.

[flyercanuck]

Just now, RonJeremy said:

You are going a little overboard,  did he tell you personally he isnt comfortable on left wing? A guy that has that kind if talent can adapt and play anywhere. It's worth a try to balance out the scoring, if after ten games he can't do it, you can move him back. Foerester, Tippett and TK all moved to the off wing and did fine.

 

I'm sure he can play there....I'm sure he can play centre. But if he's been playing RW its likely because thats where he's most effective. Play him where you're going to get the biggest bang for your buck. Move the lesser talent over.

[RonJeremy]

5 minutes ago, flyercanuck said:

 

I'm sure he can play there....I'm sure he can play centre. But if he's been playing RW its likely because thats where he's most effective. Play him where you're going to get the biggest bang for your buck. Move the lesser talent over.

We really won't know until we try, he might be even better on the left side. If you recall his previous team was not even playing him ,they were playing the older vets. Maybe he was moved to RW because the coach wanted him there because some veterans were on LW and the new goung guy got moved over. If we trade Farabee, that leaves us with no natural left wings that can score. It's fine to have a couple of guys play off wing, but we can't have all rightys on LW.

[flyercanuck]

2 minutes ago, RonJeremy said:

We really won't know until we try, he might be even better on the left side. If you recall his previous team was not even playing him ,they were playing the older vets. Maybe he was moved to RW because the coach wanted him there because some veterans were on LW and the new goung guy got moved over. If we trade Farabee, that leaves us with no natural left wings that can score. It's fine to have a couple of guys play off wing, but we can't have all rightys on LW.

 

 

I'm going to guess at 19 years of age he's played every forward position. Like I said, if you have to move someone, you don't do it with your highly touted, best prospect we've seen in so long, its pathetic.

 

His previous team (SKA) was run by an idiot who got the job through nepotism and that worked as well there as it has in Philly. 

[RonJeremy]

1 hour ago, flyercanuck said:

 

 

I'm going to guess at 19 years of age he's played every forward position. Like I said, if you have to move someone, you don't do it with your highly touted, best prospect we've seen in so long, its pathetic.

 

His previous team (SKA) was run by an idiot 9

They were preparing him for joining the Flyers

[BobbyClarkeFan16]

1 hour ago, RonJeremy said:

We really won't know until we try, he might be even better on the left side. If you recall his previous team was not even playing him ,they were playing the older vets. Maybe he was moved to RW because the coach wanted him there because some veterans were on LW and the new goung guy got moved over. If we trade Farabee, that leaves us with no natural left wings that can score. It's fine to have a couple of guys play off wing, but we can't have all rightys on LW.

I didn't think it's a good idea to have players play on their off wing at all. And it's not like it takes a couple of games for guys to adjust. Foerster might have been ok defensively on his off wing, but it took until the second half of the session before his offensive game came around. 

 

And you especially don't do something like that during training camp or the regular season. You let guys know at the beginning of the off season what the plan is. We should consider it lucky that Foerster has turned out as well as he has because that could have REALLY backfired on the Flyers.

[flyercanuck]

24 minutes ago, BobbyClarkeFan16 said:

I didn't think it's a good idea to have players play on their off wing at all. And it's not like it takes a couple of games for guys to adjust. Foerster might have been ok defensively on his off wing, but it took until the second half of the session before his offensive game came around. 

 

And you especially don't do something like that during training camp or the regular season. You let guys know at the beginning of the off season what the plan is. We should consider it lucky that Foerster has turned out as well as he has because that could have REALLY backfired on the Flyers.

 

Foerster was already playing both wings when he was in Barrie.  He usually played RW, but would slot in on the left (a la Ovechkin) on the PP.

[RonJeremy]

3 minutes ago, flyercanuck said:

 

Foerster was already playing both wings when he was in Barrie.  He usually played RW, but would slot in on the left (a la Ovechkin) on the PP.

 Voracek played off wing and he would skate in circles and never shoot, maybe he can coach the young guys.  

[AlaskaFlyerFan]

Trade all things!!!  

 

I’m not well versed on the Cap, but the Flyers need to dump some salary and not take salary back.  I agree with @jammer2 …trade for picks and prospects.  They only have $7mm after LTIR from Ellis and only 21 players signed.  Obviously, that is before any trades/buyouts.  Not a whole lot of wiggle room.

[mojo1917]

7 minutes ago, AlaskaFlyerFan said:

I’m not well versed on the Cap, but the Flyers need to dump some salary and not take salary back.

Me either, but what i do know is, the Flyers cap is kinda foocakta until 2026. That's when Hayes retention and I think Bryz buyout come off also Ellis' contract becomes a moveable entity. I think the money is cheaper than the cap hit at that time, so cap floor teams may be interested. So if a taking back a  not great contract allows for other assets to be acquired. CRAZY Danny's contract emporium is OPEN baby!!!!! all you need is a first-round pick!

[RonJeremy]

2 minutes ago, mojo1917 said:

Me either, but what i do know is, the Flyers cap is kinda foocakta until 2026. That's when Hayes retention and I think Bryz buyout come off also Ellis' contract becomes a moveable entity. I think the money is cheaper than the cap hit at that time, so cap floor teams may be interested. So if a taking back a  not great contract allows for other assets to be acquired. CRAZY Danny's contract emporium is OPEN baby!!!!! all you need is a first-round pick!

Yes, I don't think the Flyers are in any position to sign any big UFAs for another 2-3 years, maybe longer. You dont sign anyone until you are a true contender and that player is a key missing piece. We don't need alot of cap money for now. So as you said, we can take some lame contract for 2-3 years if it means getting a good pick or young prospect.